Portal Forum General Other Sports Vikings 2022-2023 Season

  • This topic has 164 replies, 33 voices, and was last updated May 13 at 11:12pm by BigbeerBigbeer.
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  • #131557 Quote
    frozen4champsfrozen4champs
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    The quest for their 1st Super Bowl appearance since Super Bowl XI starts now. They need a coach first.

    Should the Vikings get nervous that they may not get the guy they wanted?

    [media]https://twitter.com/ProFootballTalk/status/1493607353828188160[/media]

    #178331 Quote
    gatorgator
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    The Power Trip morning show and especially Meat Sauce was babbling about this.

    #178332 Quote
    frozen4champsfrozen4champs
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    Sounds like it will happen on Thursday.

    [media]https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/1493641742066884611[/media]

    #178333 Quote
    g-manpuckg-manpuck
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    PA said on KFAN this morning that he got a message from the Vikings that he was asked to be at TCO on Thursday for a Vikings Entertainment event. He couldn’t confirm that this was going to be the subject but did guess that it was.

    #178334 Quote
    frozen4champsfrozen4champs
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    #178335 Quote
    team2tankteam2tank
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    frozen4champs wrote:


    Oh Boy

    [media]https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status/1503153379018788865[/media]

    What is the Cap hit?

    #178336 Quote
    frozen4champsfrozen4champs
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    team2tank wrote:


    frozen4champs wrote:


    Oh Boy

    [media]https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status/1503153379018788865[/media]

    What is the Cap hit?

    This is what I found..

    [media]https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status/1503153545893367811[/media]

    #178337 Quote
    team2tankteam2tank
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    frozen4champs wrote:


    team2tank wrote:


    frozen4champs wrote:


    Oh Boy

    [media]https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status/1503153379018788865[/media]

    What is the Cap hit?

    This is what I found..

    [media]https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status/1503153545893367811[/media]

    Makes sense.

    No way he was a Viking and playing the last year under his other deal. Same as Rodgers.

    Either restructure or he was gone.

    #178338 Quote
    BigbeerBigbeer
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    Great.

    Not sure if this makes it harder or easier to trade him but I’m not optimistic. Sounds like they’re not talking to Houston about Watson.

    #178339 Quote
    Don Adam's Wheel of JusticeDon Adam’s Wheel of Justice
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    Bigbeer wrote:


    Great.

    Not sure if this makes it harder or easier to trade him but I’m not optimistic. Sounds like they’re not talking to Houston about Watson.


    I wouldn’t take Watson if he agreed to play for free.

    #178340 Quote
    SunboneSunbone
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    I’ve already soured on the new regime.

    #178341 Quote
    The RubeThe Rube
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    Watson still has civil suits to deal with.

    Cousins hasn’t had the same OC for 2 years in a row w/MN.

    He HAD leads in games, and the D blew it.

    Finally: O-line. Questionable.

    Kirk. Is. Not. The. Issue.

    #178342 Quote
    BeaunerBeauner
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    Interesting to see if this extension makes him a more interesting trade piece. Lower cap hits and no longer a one year deal would likely make it more palatable for a trade partner. Obviously with the NTC he has to approve it but if one of the major hangups on a trade was his cap hit this season, I’d guess this eases some concern.

    #178343 Quote
    Thirty-FourThirty-Four
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    The Rube wrote:


    Watson still has civil suits to deal with.

    Cousins hasn’t had the same OC for 2 years in a row w/MN.

    He HAD leads in games, and the D blew it.

    Finally: O-line. Questionable.

    Kirk. Is. Not. The. Issue.

    Agreed on Watson. Cousins’ contract is an issue. I don’t thinking kicking the can ahead another year is a great plan, we’ll see.

    #178344 Quote
    J22J22
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    sunbone wrote:


    I’ve already soured on the new regime.

    If Cousins plays another down for the Vikings, then they’re already failures.

    #178345 Quote
    The RubeThe Rube
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    Kirk’s number is big, don’t get me wrong. There are rumors of Danielle to BUF, that would help the cap, also.

    There is no pleasing the Kirk haters. I can only say that the blame should be placed elsewhere.

    #178346 Quote
    BeaunerBeauner
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    The Rube wrote:


    Watson still has civil suits to deal with.

    Cousins hasn’t had the same OC for 2 years in a row w/MN.

    He HAD leads in games, and the D blew it.

    Finally: O-line. Questionable.

    Kirk. Is. Not. The. Issue.

    Four QBs played 16 or more games last season that got sacked as infrequently as Kirk did. Kirk was sacked 28 times. So was Mahomes and Mac Jones (Mahomes is significantly more elusive obviously) were both sacked 28 times. Josh Allen was sacked 26 times and is significantly more mobile. Tom Brady was sacked 22 times.

    The OL was considerably better than “questionable” last season.

    #178347 Quote
    The RubeThe Rube
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    It’s deeper than sacks, and you know this. ;) It’s amount of time before they get to the QB. Kirk threw it away a few times, rightfully, to avoid the sack.

    #178348 Quote
    frozen4champsfrozen4champs
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    #178349 Quote
    BladepullerBladepuller
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    I think I’ve pointed out before that pressure up the middle is faster to get to the QB & also limits visibility for the QB to get rid of the ball.

    RG & to a lesser degree the OC is a problem(s) for the Vikings.

    Kirk is what he is; a professional who doesn’t get hurt & can’t carry an offense. He can run one though.

    #178350 Quote
    BeaunerBeauner
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    The Rube wrote:


    It’s deeper than sacks, and you know this. ;) It’s amount of time before they get to the QB. Kirk threw it away a few times, rightfully, to avoid the sack.

    It is deeper than sacks. But he was 5th in YPA and 10th in completion percentage using the same 16 game baseline. So this meme that he threw the ball away a ton or did nothing but checkdowns is just wrong. The interior OL had unquestionably some very poor games, but to act like he was constantly under pressure is wrong.

    #178351 Quote
    BeaunerBeauner
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    Bladepuller wrote:


    I think I’ve pointed out before that pressure up the middle is faster to get to the QB & also limits visibility for the QB to get rid of the ball.

    RG & to a lesser degree the OC is a problem(s) for the Vikings.

    Kirk is what he is; a professional who doesn’t get hurt & can’t carry an offense. He can run one though.

    Udoh was definitely below average at RG. Hopefully Wyatt Davis can step up next season.

    #178352 Quote
    The RubeThe Rube
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    Beauner wrote:


    The Rube wrote:


    It’s deeper than sacks, and you know this. ;) It’s amount of time before they get to the QB. Kirk threw it away a few times, rightfully, to avoid the sack.

    It is deeper than sacks. But he was 5th in YPA and 10th in completion percentage using the same 16 game baseline. So this meme that he threw the ball away a ton or did nothing but checkdowns is just wrong. The interior OL had unquestionably some very poor games, but to act like he was constantly under pressure is wrong.

    He wasn’t constantly under pressure. The O-Line did contribute a lot to his woes, or should I say blame, in the matter.

    He can manage a game, and put the team in place to win a game. Sometimes lead them to a win, with heroics and such. Is he a Brady/ARodg/Allen/Mahomes? Hell no. I still would put him top 10 QB in the league.

    #178353 Quote
    ScoobyDooScoobyDoo
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    Top 10?. No.

    #178354 Quote
    The RubeThe Rube
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    ScoobyDoo wrote:

    Top 10?. No.

    Start naming the 10 better than him. I already named 4. Lamar Jackson is 5. Go. Name five QBs better than Kirk.

    #178355 Quote
    BertogliatBertogliat
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    Kirk isn’t a bad WB. He just isn’t good enough to will a team to victory. No team fears Kirk Cousins. He isn’t good enough to have a cap killing contract. So I am happy he’s restructured. I still think he’s overpaid.

    But the Vikes were bare assed over a barrel.

    #178356 Quote
    The RubeThe Rube
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    Bertogliat wrote:


    Kirk isn’t a bad WB. He just isn’t good enough to will a team to victory. No team fears Kirk Cousins. He isn’t good enough to have a cap killing contract. So I am happy he’s restructured. I still think he’s overpaid.

    But the Vikes were bare assed over a barrel.

    He won’t WIN a game with last minute heroics. But he’ll be damned if he loses one for you. He’ll put points on the board. Then, let the rest of the team finish up.

    #178357 Quote
    BeaunerBeauner
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    The Rube wrote:


    Bertogliat wrote:


    Kirk isn’t a bad WB. He just isn’t good enough to will a team to victory. No team fears Kirk Cousins. He isn’t good enough to have a cap killing contract. So I am happy he’s restructured. I still think he’s overpaid.

    But the Vikes were bare assed over a barrel.

    He won’t WIN a game with last minute heroics. But he’ll be damned if he loses one for you. He’ll put points on the board. Then, let the rest of the team finish up.

    He put the team in position to win via “last minute heroics” multiple times over the last couple seasons… kickers missing chip shots and defensive collapses aren’t his fault. Unless people want to blame him for not spending enough time on the go-ahead drive.

    In the last two seasons he has 7 fourth quarter comebacks/GW drives on his record. And that only counts for games the team WON. I can think of 3-4 more that would have fit that category if the defense didn’t piss down their legs (or the kicker could make a chip shot).

    Hell, even the Bengals game he drove the team down the field for a FG to send to OT and had the team at the edge of FG range again in OT before Dalvin’s not-a-fumble was ruled a fumble. 🤷‍♂️ They were down 21-7 and 24-14 at different times in the fourth quarter and forced OT.

    #178358 Quote
    Thirty-FourThirty-Four
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    Kirk is a top 12-15 QB, which can lead to a title in certain circumstances. I don’t believe, however, that a QB rated as near mediocre, has won a Super Bowl while so highly compensated, comparable, in the cap era.

    #178359 Quote
    SunboneSunbone
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    Anybody that thinks that Cousins is going to lead a team to a Super Bowl is out of their mind in my opinion. I’m hoping Beauner’s right that the extension will make him easier to trade. But I’m really doubting that is what they are thinking.

    #178360 Quote
    Thirty-FourThirty-Four
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    The scary thing to me on reviewing the Cousin’s situation here? If Jay Cutler had any of whatever public mojo Cousin’s has: He might still be our quarterback. 🤮

    #178361 Quote
    The RubeThe Rube
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    The Rube wrote:


    ScoobyDoo wrote:

    Top 10?. No.

    Start naming the 10 better than him. I already named 4. Lamar Jackson is 5. Go. Name five QBs better than Kirk.

    Since he couldn’t do it, Thrity-Four, maybe you can. :)

    #178362 Quote
    ScoobyDooScoobyDoo
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    #178363 Quote
    JWGJWG
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    sunbone wrote:


    Anybody that thinks that Cousins is going to lead a team to a Super Bowl is out of their mind in my opinion. I’m hoping Beauner’s right that the extension will make him easier to trade. But I’m really doubting that is what they are thinking.

    He has a no trade clause.

    But maybe had to do it to get a deal that was cap friendly as they were running out of time to make the 3/16 deadline to be under the cap.

    #178364 Quote
    HammyHammy
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    I don’t mind the deal. If there was some obvious (realistic) alternative that gave the team a better opportunity to win, I’d be all ears.

    But I am not convinced there is somebody else out there (within reason from a trade cost perspective) that would be a better option. Somebody like Watson would be expensive in a trade (and also from a cap hit).

    I certainly doubt any rookie QB in this class would step in and be better.

    Unless you just want to blow it all up and (probably) stink on offense (which probably won’t sit well with guys like Jefferson and Cook), I don’t see getting rid of Cousins as the right move right now.

    #178365 Quote
    BeaunerBeauner
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    ScoobyDoo wrote:


    Kirk ranks 13th. Not top 10.

    https://www.nfl.com/news/nfl-qb-index-end-of-2021-nfl-season-rankings

    Kirk is better than at least two QBs on that list ahead of him, IMO.

    I’m taking him over Derek Carr and I’m without question taking him over Ryan Tannehill. For me (and apparently Amari Cooper) he’s about on par with Dak Prescott. Top 10ish (maybe 11),

    #178366 Quote
    BeaunerBeauner
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    Hammy wrote:


    I don’t mind the deal. If there was some obvious (realistic) alternative that gave the team a better opportunity to win, I’d be all ears.

    But I am not convinced there is somebody else out there (within reason from a trade cost perspective) that would be a better option. Somebody like Watson would be expensive in a trade (and also from a cap hit).

    I certainly doubt any rookie QB in this class would step in and be better.

    Unless you just want to blow it all up and (probably) stink on offense (which probably won’t sit well with guys like Jefferson and Cook), I don’t see getting rid of Cousins as the right move right now.

    Exactly.

    And I don’t think the new coaching staff and front office took this job as their first premier role and said “Let’s blow this thing apart and tank for 3 years” because there is no guarantee they’d keep their job, let alone find another job if/when they got fired.

    I would assume KOC looked at the roster and said “We can win with these offensive weapons” (which they probably can, TBH, JJ is a top 10 WR, Thielen is top 20-25, Dalvin is one of the 3-4 best RBs in the league, Irv Smith Jr./Tyler Conklin are both effective pass catchers at TE). I doubt a new coach is going to take a job and say “Let’s dismantle this whole team and suck for 3 years while we try to rebuild, and then i get 4 games of my fourth season to keep my job!”

    #178367 Quote
    JWGJWG
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    Unless your QB is Mahommes, Rodgers, or Brady (again) you’re never satisfied with whoever is at that position. Cousins is a good QB and a top QB in the league. You can choose to believe it or not, that’s fine, but he is not the single limiting factor to the Vikings being great. More teams in the league than not would take Cousins as their QB.

    #178368 Quote
    J22J22
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    The Rube wrote:


    The Rube wrote:


    ScoobyDoo wrote:

    Top 10?. No.

    Start naming the 10 better than him. I already named 4. Lamar Jackson is 5. Go. Name five QBs better than Kirk.

    Since he couldn’t do it, Thrity-Four, maybe you can. :)

    Mahomes

    Rodgers

    Brady

    Watson

    Prescott

    Jackson

    Burrow

    Allen

    Murray

    Wilson

    Stafford

    Herbert

    There’s 12 that aren’t even debatable. Cousins fits in somewhere after those 12 with guys like Ryan, Wentz, Garappolo, Carr, Tannehill, and Jones.

    #178369 Quote
    bearpaw28bearpaw28
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    Even if you exclude Watson due to his legal issues…the other 11 are not debatable. Prescott can make something out of nothing, Cousins can’t. Lamar Jackson brings a running element that no other QB brings and was a league MVP. All the others are in a completely different tier than Cousins. I hope KOC can coach him up, and hopefully he will be more aggressive and not so much a check down Charlie under KOC. But in terms of improvising when a play breaks down, Kirk is what he is ☝️

    #178370 Quote
    BigbeerBigbeer
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    Beauner wrote:


    ScoobyDoo wrote:


    Kirk ranks 13th. Not top 10.

    https://www.nfl.com/news/nfl-qb-index-end-of-2021-nfl-season-rankings

    Kirk is better than at least two QBs on that list ahead of him, IMO.

    I’m taking him over Derek Carr and I’m without question taking him over Ryan Tannehill. For me (and apparently Amari Cooper) he’s about on par with Dak Prescott. Top 10ish (maybe 11),


    While that’s true they also have Lamar Jackson and 3-4 other young QBs ranked behind him on that list that should definitely be ahead of him if you factor in age and potential. He’s middle of the pack making too much money. Once Spielman extended his deal the first time it screwed up the Vikings for years. And why he’s getting all guaranteed money is beyond me.

    And the Dolphins just signed Bridgewater to be Tua’s backup. I know he’s from Miami but the Vikings couldn’t get him to come back here and be a backup? My assumption is they are already putting as much money as they can into the QB position.

    #178371 Quote
    BigbeerBigbeer
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    Question asked to Willie McGinest on NFL Network:

    “Vikings extended Cousins, is this the right move for them?”

    His answer:”it’s the right move for them, but not anybody else…he’s made $230 million and his career record is 61-62-2”

    #178372 Quote
    BertogliatBertogliat
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    He’s the Bert Blyleven of football.

    #178373 Quote
    frozen4champsfrozen4champs
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    #178374 Quote
    J22J22
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    Bertogliat wrote:


    He’s the Bert Blyleven of football.

    Blyleven showed up in big games

    #178375 Quote
    SunboneSunbone
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    J22 wrote:


    Bertogliat wrote:


    He’s the Bert Blyleven of football.

    Blyleven showed up in big games

    And won two titles. So, nothing like Cousins at all.

    #178376 Quote
    Bonin21Bonin21
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    Bigbeer wrote:


    Question asked to Willie McGinest on NFL Network:

    “Vikings extended Cousins, is this the right move for them?”

    His answer:”it’s the right move for them, but not anybody else…he’s made $230 million and his career record is 61-62-2”

    What a perfect answer.

    #178377 Quote
    The RubeThe Rube
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    ScoobyDoo wrote:


    Kirk ranks 13th. Not top 10.

    https://www.nfl.com/news/nfl-qb-index-end-of-2021-nfl-season-rankings

    Well, using passer rating for a career, Cousins is better than Brady: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_National_Football_League_career_passer_rating_leaders

    There are lies, damn lies, and statistics. ;)

    Edit: better yet, IMO, I think Kirk is about 7th-8th best in the league right now (the top 5 are rock solid, cannot argue otherwise: Brady, Rodgers, Allen, Mahomes, Jackson).

    #178378 Quote
    The RubeThe Rube
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    frozen4champs wrote:


    [media]https://twitter.com/SKORNorth/status/1503532350378024967[/media]

    Bills fans are very sad, but they understand. They think the Vikes made a great move here, given MN’s D situation.

    #178379 Quote
    frozen4champsfrozen4champs
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    #178380 Quote
    frozen4champsfrozen4champs
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    #178381 Quote
    BeaunerBeauner
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    Former Vikings 1st round pick Jeff Gladney signed with the Cardinals today after being found not guilty for assault last week.

    #178382 Quote
    frozen4champsfrozen4champs
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    #178383 Quote
    College Hockey AddictCollege Hockey Addict
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    #178384 Quote
    BeaunerBeauner
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    CollegeHockeyAddict wrote:


    https://twitter.com/FieldYates/status/1506041776146161665

    A healthy Smith and healthy Hunter would be nightmarish for opposing QBs.

    #178385 Quote
    BeaunerBeauner
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    #178386 Quote
    College Hockey AddictCollege Hockey Addict
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    #178387 Quote
    BigbeerBigbeer
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    Beauner wrote:


    CollegeHockeyAddict wrote:


    https://twitter.com/FieldYates/status/1506041776146161665

    A healthy Smith and healthy Hunter would be nightmarish for opposing QBs.

    Defense will be imposing for those 6 games

    #178388 Quote
    Chris83Chris83
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    Would be cool if they could move up in the first round of the draft and grab CB Ahmad Gardner; I realize that’s highly improbable, but Gardner will be gone by #12. If so, hopefully Daryl Stingley Jr or Trent McDuffie are still available. A shutdown CB would be another great upgrade to the defense.

    #178389 Quote
    frozen4champsfrozen4champs
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    #178390 Quote
    BigbeerBigbeer
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    Good, Peterson was a rock over there and a great veteran presence

    #178330 Quote
    The RubeThe Rube
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    #198791 Quote
    College Hockey AddictCollege Hockey Addict
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    Washington is on clock now with pick 11 and then it’s the Vikings at pick 12. The following have yet to be picked

     

    WRs Jameson Williams and Chris Olave

    DE Jermaine Johnson

    DT Jordan Davis

    S Kyle Hamilton

    #198793 Quote
    College Hockey AddictCollege Hockey Addict
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    Washington traded pick #11 to the Saints. The Saints pick WR Chris Olave.

    #198794 Quote
    Bonin21Bonin21
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    According to WalterFootball, they take Hamilton now. Three WR off the board so don’t go there now.

    #198795 Quote
    Bonin21Bonin21
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    NVM

    #198796 Quote
    Chill KesselChill Kessel
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    Vikes traded the pick

    #198799 Quote
    Bonin21Bonin21
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    lol

    #198800 Quote
    College Hockey AddictCollege Hockey Addict
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    The Vikings trade pick #12 to the Lions. Is Spellman still running the draft?

    #198802 Quote
    gatorgator
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    Seems like the Lions got the better deal out of that trade.

    • This reply was modified 3 weeks, 3 days ago by gatorgator.
    #198803 Quote
    HammyHammy
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    Dropping 20 spots in the first round and only getting that in return?

    #198804 Quote
    BigbeerBigbeer
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    I’m thinking the Vikings will move back up  to take a CB depending on how the picks fall.

    …possibly McDuffie from Wash?

     

    of course Baltimore makes the great pick and Hamilton is gone. Would have loved to see the Vikings get him.

    • This reply was modified 3 weeks, 3 days ago by BigbeerBigbeer.
    #198806 Quote
    Chill KesselChill Kessel
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    Here is the summary

     

    #198808 Quote
    BigbeerBigbeer
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    Great to see all the top WRs get drafted without the Packers getting any of them

    #198809 Quote
    College Hockey AddictCollege Hockey Addict
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    Would be interesting if the Vikings drafted Boye Mafe.

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